What god ?

One experience that many atheists have is the bewilderment of theists over how a person can be moral and good without believing in a god. Their attitude seems to be that morality cannot exist without some sort of god, and preferably their god. Ergo, atheists must be fundamentally immoral. I was surprised to find that even some people at libertyforum seem to think such thoughts, so I emailed one of them asking why they believe in the bible. Further down the correspondence I replied with this;

> Because I know of God's existence,

No, you don't know of his existence, you have created your knowledge of him existing. Humans have created this "god" thing, yet humans have not been created by your god, which makes your assumption that this god exists rather shortsighted and selfish. Without your thoughts, there would never have been one, ever. You can rest assured that a god does NOT exist. There's proof of that. In fact it's simple CSI 101 (as you so often use in your writing yourself).

> The reason why whatever scientists, etc, you mention, think they "know there
> is no God" is because they are attempting to "find" or locate Him

We aren't looking for him anywhere, because we know there's no god to look for. If it would be there, it would have made itself known by now, wouldn't you say?

When I tell people I don't believe in a god, some of them look at me like I'm ready to kill them. They see a man without values, a man totally ruined or something. Some people even ask me what is stopping me from going on a rampage. I have never been able to successfully tell them that these two have nothing to do with each other. Atheists are normal fun-loving people. They have their basic values. To know that killing and raping is bad doesn't need a god. People say Conscience is god. No, Conscience is the values you learned and you want to uphold. It is the basic YOU. You feel guilty not because god finds that you've done something bad but because you do.
I remember one particular incident when a friend of mine was talking about a person who has 4 wives. He said that "people who say they don't believe in God do all the wrong they want". I told him I don't believe in god either, and that this does not mean I can do any wrong. Well, his mind could only come up with "That means you believe in God in some corner of your heart". I really pity people who talk like this. They say that only a 'god-fearing person' can stick to values and morals. So, if somehow it is proven that god never existed, will this person still hold on to his values? If it's just god who is stopping you from raping or stealing, then what are you? What morals do you have? I think it's better to say "God doesn't stop me from doing anything, I chose not to do it out of my own free will"!

One more thing that people believe in is that atheists need explanations about anything and that's why they cannot accept god, who is more of faith. I disagree there too. It is the believers who need explanations and that's why anything inexplicable becomes god's deeds. How are these mountains made? "Oh my! I don't know" is what they think, but what they say is "God made them!"
Isn't it better to say, "I don't know but there must be some reason" ?
They put anything out of their mind's reach into the realms of God, satisfying themselves that it is out of their control and thus never wanting to know about it anymore. They fool themselves all day long. And that is why I pity these people.

The bottom line is: It is better to believe in yourself than in some god. It is better to take credit for your actions than to say god made you do it. It is better to be right by will than by fear.

I am an atheist and I don't do morals. Rather like a god or gods; I have no need to think about them because they do not exist, except in other people's minds. My values are personal and generally rigidly held, although in some instances they can be fluid. On occasion I have found that my values are too rigid - even, I had to admit, downright wrong. I have had to absorb new knowledge into old values, I have even changed some altogether. It can be a difficult and emotionally painful process, but at least I am not restricted to a rigid behavioral framework written down by some retards who lived hundreds or thousands of years ago.

I have found my values becoming more pliable as I have grown older. I have found I can forgive more readily, I have found I can accept the behavior exhibited by some people that I would have outright condemned as a young man. Forgiveness isn't something we should be told we need to do if we are to enter a fictitious heaven. Forgiveness allows us to grow as individuals, to learn from our own and other people's mistakes. Forgiveness is essential for our peace of mind.

I know I have no maker I will go to and live with when I die. And yet, I hope that some of my words and actions will have influenced others so that they might live their lives with values that are firmly held, but fluid when needs demand. By passing on my knowledge and values, and, of course, by possibly passing on my genes and creations, I will live on when I die (even though the use of that is still unclear to me, it is clear that your god doesn't have the answer to that either).
You honestly do not need religion to be a good person.

I'm sorry to tell you this, but you being this religious person downgrades the value of your assumptions on other subjects on libertyforum. This is also what makes both your president Bush and our president Balkenende total idiots; it's a shame people like this have so much power over us and can decide what we're allowed to do. We can use more atheists promoting a positive vision of life rather than a religious one dominated by fear, guilt and superstition, if you ask me.